Experts Only Episode 17: My Conversation with Ethan Zindler, Head of Americas, Bloomberg New Energy Finance Join us this week for a great conversation with Ethan Zindler, Head of Americas at Bloomberg New Energy Finance. Ethan’s career has taken him from baggage checker on the Clinton campaign to the White House to MTV to the early days of clean energy covering Cape Wind. For the last 12 years, as Head of Americas for Bloomberg NEF, he’s been at the helm when it comes to clean energy research, with industry leading data on deals and market reports, trends and forecasting. Today we have a great discussion about the market trends and the progress of the industry over the last 10 years. I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. The full episode transcript is below. The Launch of a Clean Energy Career: From the Clinton Campaign to the White House to MTV Jon Powers (JP): Ethan, thank you so much for joining us. You know, you have a fascinating background and there’s a lot to cover with Bloomberg New Energy Finance, but I want to step back a little bit and talk about your broader personal history. You actually spent some time in the political scene working on a Clinton/Gore campaign and then later in the White House. What, first of all, what led you down that track in what was your role in the White House? Ethan Zindler (EZ): So I was definitely a political sort of junky. I’m all the way from high school through college. I worked on a number of campaigns, the Clinton one you know about, because that’s the one where we won, before that I worked on the Dukakis campaign because I’m from Brookline, Massachusetts, which is where Dukakis is from. And then worked for Feinstein when she ran, but lost for governor, eventually she became senator. So I’d always just been really into politics and really, really into campaigns. And so I did that. Then when Clinton won, JP: What was your role in the campaign? EZ: The first half of the Clinton campaign, I was sort of a glorified baggage checker, in other words, I was in charge of making sure that the press didn’t lose their bags on the plane, which sometimes happened. For the second half of the campaign I had a great job where I was the “Youth Media Coordinator”. And my job was to get Clinton to do MTV and get Clinton to talk to college press and doing radio actualities for college radio stations. And all kinds of stuff that back then seemed really cool, hip and happening, but which now seems ancient as the Internet came away and basically made all that stuff seemed really old. But back then, believe it or not, getting a presidential candidate on something other than NBC, CBS or ABC was considered sort of unconventional. . JP: Well, you were a pioneer then. EZ: Yes, I was. Then at the White House I worked in the Office of National Service, which was the office that wrote the Americorps legislation and got that passed which was a big priority for president. Frankly it was more or less like a two line campaign promise that had almost no policy behind it. Then when we won it was like, wow, OK, we’ve got to actually make this happen. But luckily there was an office called the Office of National Service that had been established under Bush. And what we learned is that mostly what the people who had been in that office had been doing is writing press releases to sort of site different things that people had done in service but not actually been responsible for writing legislation or overseeing really anything. So that was, what was that? Americorps is a great program. It’s survived a lot of attempts eliminate it for sure. JP: The transition from the White House to MTV. How did that happen? EZ: At MTV, the one that’s maybe the most interesting was that I became their “web producer.” So in 2000, was the first year, pretty much that MTV had decided that they wanted to cover a presidential campaign on the Internet. Back then the idea of having like a website, well that was pretty unusual. So we did a lot of fun stuff to try and cover the campaign. We’re very much integrated with the folks who were covering the campaign on air as well. That’s the choose or loose group. It sounds incredibly antiquated now, but it was a lot of fun actually. JP: So was Rock the Vote Around then? EZ: Rock the vote was definitely very much about sort of registering people. Choose or lose, which is the MTV thing was about covering the campaign. I mean it was ultimately all about getting people registered to vote. So that was the end goal, but we really tried to take an even handed way of covering that campaign, the Bush Gore campaign, which of course then when it overtime for about a month, but it was a lot of fun. Right? Making the Career Transition to Clean Energy JP: So what lead from that to clean energy? EZ:I f this sounds like a circuitous, career path, it’s because it was. I then went to businesses school and the thought was, well, you know, maybe I’ll do this and then I’ll come back and work in the media business some more. But I went to business school and then while I was there, I graduated at a time that was just the worst time, or at least at that point, what seemed like the worst time for anybody to get out of a business school program. My wife had just had a daughter and I looked at a lot of my fellow graduates and they really were having trouble finding jobs. I’m from New England originally and I spent a lot of time on Cape Cod as a kid and there was a job at the local newspaper there as the one and only business reporter for the Cape Cod Times. I knew that I figured I was qualified. I also figured I’d frankly be the lowest paid member of the Columbia Business School graduating class. But I would have a job and my wife and I were ready to get in New York Post 9-11, I think with a daughter. We were pretty much done for at least a while. I went to the paper and I loved it. I think it’s just a fantastic place to work and interesting people and real commitment to good journalism. So we picked up, we moved to West Yarmouth, Massachusetts where I lived and I covered stories and eventually I am getting to clean energy. I knew even at business school when I was looking at the Cape Cod Times that they were building or trying to build a major offshore wind project out there called Cape Wind. And I thought, wow, if I’m the business reporter, I guess I’ll get to cover that. Covering the Cape Wind Beat for the Cape Cod Times EZ: Frankly, it took me a good year at the paper before they let me touch the story because there were other people already covering it. It was the hottest story the Cape Cod times was covering. But eventually I got to cover it. So I got really familiar with the Cape Wind project, the controversy surrounding it. I knew the opponents. I know Jim Gordon well as the developer and did a lot of work. I tried to use my MBA as much as I could to try and think about the cash flows around that project and how it could pencil out and how it could work and all the things that are around it. It was a fantastic experience. On a good day you’d write a story that would make the front page and both sides would call and yell at you. It happened pretty frequently, with both the opponents and the supporters of the project. JP: So what led from that into further research in clean energy and of course Bloomberg? EZ: About three years into that, I loved it, but my wife was ready to move back to a larger urban area. So she moved down first. Then found out about this new outlet called New Energy Finance. It was just starting, of course, back then, it was a very small industry. I heard about this guy Michael Liebreich. He was starting a company in London. I was down here in DC and Making the career move to the startup New Energy Finance: “The Saudi Arabia of Data” EZ: I wish I could even remember the exact time but it about then and he said, hey, we’re going to start this thing up. And I’m actually at the time of new energy finance was, two things were, one, it was, it was very, very small. Two, I was going to be the first US employee. They had no employees in the United States at all. So I interviewed with him and I was like, oh, it sounds good, but like, what the hell is this going to be? And it’s a startup and I got a kid and you know, how am I going to make all this work? So he said, look, you know, if you want to check us out, if you fly over to London, if you pay for the ticket and then you take the job will reimburse for you if you don’t, then that ticket is on you. So I said, all right, so I flew over to London, showed up on a Saturday morning, and I went over to the office and I rang the bell and actually nobody answered and I thought this is a huge mistake and, but I spent the day talking with the CEO, Michael Liebreich, whose somebody I admire a great deal to this day. And I talked with about five other people and each one of the people I asked about New Energy Finance. I said, so what’s the business model in each one of them gave me a totally different answer and so, you know, but my belief was basically that these technologies were really exciting, that they would change the world that were, they were somewhat inevitable. And frankly that’s the one thing I give myself credit itself for, not for believing in the right company or anything or being a genius, but just believing that this stuff was actually going to grow. And so I was very fortunate and have been since then. JP:And you’ve been able to see the growth of that industry. I mean, we’re now at a point where, we’re through the evolution of do these technologies even work and now it’s how do we drive down capital to get more implementation? EZ: Exactly. So it was back in those days, it was just sort of like, will there be a good feed in tariff or strong subsidy? OK, that’s where there’ll be a market, Then that market disappears, you know, that still happens to some degree today, but you know, we’ve now definitely moved to the point where this stuff is legitimately economic. JP: For our listeners, explain what Bloomberg New Energy Finance does and talk a little bit about the growth over the last really 12 years since you’ve been there. EZ: It was called New Energy Finance and start up company. And again, there were about 20-25 of us when I joined in about 2005 and at the time basically we didn’t really know what the business was going to be other than we wanted to gather as much reliable data and information as we could about all this stuff that was happening and what the actual revenue model is going to be for us was far from clear. We used to joke was that we had sort of the Saudi Arabia of energy data. Everybody was just constantly logging deals and logging organizations and every scrap of data we could get, we put it into a database. The closest that we had come to an actual publication was that we would publish a newsletter every month, including one on the Americas, which I used to do. The reality of it is that was kind of it. We started to get subscribers and grant people to access the data and that worked OK, but it didn’t generate a lot of money. At some point we said to ourselves, wait, OK, we’ve now been doing this for about three years. Why don’t we write more in depth research about the map, the trends, not just news, but like actually what’s going on. The micro economic stuff, we have all this data, we can analyze it ourselves and besides, nobody else is doing it and this industry is not that old that there are any super well established experts that we can’t potentially be those people. So we started and have sold access to the research that we produce and importantly access to the underlying data. I think that’s always something we’re trying to emphasize as differentiators that we don’t just say, OK, we think there’s this much wind that is going to get built next year. We say, OK, this is how much wind is going to get built. Here’s the excel sheet where you can take a look at the projects and where we think they’re going to be built and If you disagree, you know, go ahead. We shuffle the data and come up with a different forecast. JP: You guys were playing Big Data. Before it was a cool thing, EZ: Thankfully it was little big data because it wasn’t that much going on in the industry. It wasn’t that hard that you couldn’t have like a dozen of us basically just tap tap tapping stuff into a database. The Professionalization of Clean Energy – The “Ponytail Factor” JP: So over time with that growth, what have you seen in the industry and what are your projecting out as the exciting things for the industry moving forward? EZ: My old friend Jody Roussel from the American Council on Renewable Energy (ACORE) used to joke about the ponytail factor. And so in the early days of clean energy, she used to say that the sign of progress was the decreasing number of men with ponytails. Little did she know that that was back 10 years ago. Now it’s man buns or whatever, I don’t know if that’s a good metric anymore. But back then you saw a sort of professionalization of the industry is more as frankly it became less people who are sort of advocates, even with great respect to people who are advocates. But it became less about advocates and more about money people and entrepreneurs and people who are hard headed and professional. And so definitely have seen a lot more of that and a lot more people have come in and certainly opportunists along with them, that’s for sure. But look, you need that to make the industry grow. So that’s been a huge thing. And then I would say that the professionalization, the second thing has been commoditization I would say in terms of particularly around solar equipment as you know, the price of solar equipment has plummeted and it’s being driven by economies of scale more than anything. I think for a long time there, it was really all about technology, technology, technology, all these different types of technologies that were out there. And I think it’s still a fascinating industry in terms of the various technologies that could still change our world. But as you know, the things that have really come along had been more about scale and less, not less about technology, but there hasn’t been that kind of Super Eureka moment I would say for solar. It’s still basically the same technology was looking at 10 years ago. It’s just being done so much bigger and cheaper than it was. JP: There’s less reliance on the concept of like the holy grail. EZ: Yeah, it’s gotta be that one thing that just sort of changes our world. Even batteries people keep talking about in the same context, but batteries again, it’s scale. It’s really, really driven down costs. Discussing Clean Energy Investment Trends: Clean Energy Investing is still “immature” JP: So I’m going to dive into one of the recent reports you guys put out earlier this month at Bloomberg New Energy Finance reported that global investment in clean energy such as wind and solar, reached about $333.5 billion in 2017. It’s about a three percent rise from last year, but about seven percent off the record overall. What do you view as driving this trend and what do you think of those 2017 numbers? EZ: I think the good news about the numbers, is that the price per unit of wind and solar and keep coming down. So if you keep posting dollar figures that are more or less in the same zone and we really have been somewhere in the neighborhood of $300 billion now for the last five or six years, you’re talking about more and more stuff getting built. I actually don’t have a final number on total clean energy built this year, but it’s probably going to be somewhere around a 150-160 gigawatts. It’s a lot of capacity and it’s a majority of the new power generating capacity that’s getting built typically in a year is now zero carbon and particularly if you include large hydro, definitely if you include nuclear. My first thing, is always evidence that we should not refer to this as alternative energy. This is mainstream energy. There’s no question about that. I would say that’s the main sort of takeaway I would say from last year. The other thing is under underlying that of course is the phenomenon of China, which is just incredible. It continues to blow our minds, we have counted about 50 gigawatts of solar that got built in China last year. I think our high water mark in the US is like, I don’t know, 12 or 15 gigawatts. So that is A LOT of solar. Every time we think it’s just going to cool down a little bit. It just goes, it just goes and goes. So China’s roughly about half the world, about 40 percent of all total investment in the world went into China for clean energy. JP: I want to come back to China, I want to come back to the international space cause it’s exciting that stuff is happening there. It’s equally exciting internationally, which is great for the industry. Going back to the $333 billion over last few years, the World Economic Forum put out a report last year that less than half a percent of institutional capital is invested in the space. It continues to rise, there is targets to reach one percent, which will be great. But looking at that $300 billion figure, do you guys breakdown where some of that’s coming from? EZ: It’s interesting actually. There’s two kind of data sets in terms of dollars. So there’s also green bond financing, which is typically over $100 billion, but it is not an enough going to check what our final number is going to be for 2017, but it’ll be somewhere around that. It’s actually not a subset because while there’s some overlap, but there’s some differences as well and include some things that aren’t clean energy, just to be clear. The trend has been clearly upward on the part of institutional investors in some ways. I always sort of joke and say that that the way in which our industry raises money is still really immature. So you have ~$300 billion dollars and then, you know, the large majority of that is project finance. In the large majority of the project finance is simply money that’s raised through some form of syndication of debt. There is a small handful of number of players, but we’re talking now, tens, hundreds of billions, the industry could and should and is in some cases raising money and larger chunks over the institutional markets through bond offerings and pension fund investment. So I think that’s the way things have to keep going. I think we’ll see more of that because I think amazingly enough there’s still a lot of people for whom they’re still like, wow, wind/solar, that’s kind of weird technology. What’s the risk about?, well wait a second guys. Like now we’ve got a lot of years of performance here to show that this works. Second, take the fuel price risk out of the equation. Like don’t tell me that this is higher risk than projects where you really don’t know what your input costs are going to be over 20 year life span. So I think actually institutional investors are figuring that out. And on top of that, they are facing some pressure of course, to move away from investments in fossil fuels. So those two things combined and you definitely see some of the players, the California pension funds, like definitely been in it for awhile, but you see some interesting moves recently a Quebec pension fund bought a portfolio of Mexican wind projects. The Texas state teachers retirement fund is taking direct investments in renewables projects as well. So there’s more, just definitely more to come in that sense. JP: It’s interesting you brought up the check size too because I think what we see in the market today is you’ve got folks that are beginning to get interested in, the education and the pressure is there from stakeholders. But there has to be the right check size for them to even take a look. And you know, unless you’re talking to utility scale solar or utility-scale wind, you know, putting that check size together is challenging. Right? And you’ve got an aggregate. But I think the projects now are out there in size and scale enough to begin to attract it. EZ: I mean, look, we’re probably the most bullish about distributed solar, like almost anybody and we think it’s going to really revolutionize the world. The reality is it’s always going to be, I mean, if it gets bigger, it’s going to go from tens of hundreds of thousands of systems to millions of systems and it’s gotta get aggregated, right? It’s got to in order to keep driving the costs of finance down. JP: Do you have a lot of those institutional is coming to you all for data? EZ: We do. A bunch of them are clients. I would say this. So it’s interesting for us as a business is that it’s more often to be someone who’s directly involved in direct project finance of individual projects and less likely to be someone who’s at a pension fund for the reason you’re sort of saying that they haven’t done as much historically, but the more that the pension funds get involved, the better. And the other thing is, you know, our business now we’re part of Bloomberg, so our data and information is available over the Bloomberg terminal. Actually that’s where a lot of these large pension fund folks have terminal access, so a big part of what we’re doing is saying hello, you’ve got a terminal and if you’re interested in clean energy and hey, did you know, you could look up the last 10 wind farm financings in Texas if you want. See who did them. In many cases like, oh, I didn’t know that. JP: You see them coming to some of the events too? EZ: Yeah, they definitely come to the events we’ll have at our summit, which I’ll give a plug for an April. We’re definitely going to have a panel. You know, we’ve done it before. We’ll do another one to sort of do a lay of the land, will certainly have California where I presented on that. We’ll probably have someone from New York state represented on there. I think we’re trying to have someone who’s from Quebec, but we would like to also have, whether it’s Texas or somebody else, there’s some funds that are really been the, the most on the front foot on this stuff but more starting to come around now. The Politics of Clean Energy in the U.S. under Trump Administration JP: Before we go international, we’re sitting here in Washington DC, about six blocks away from the White House leading into 2017. There was a definite gasp, clean energy experts for fear of what was going to happen. But I think what we’re seeing federal policy aside, this has become a state level game. You know, the right things that moving the cost of capital is coming down. The cost of the panels are coming down, wind projects are being implemented in a conservative states that are getting champions. that I think none of us expected. We are a year into the Trump administration. Putting aside the solar tariff piece, what do you guys view as the effects of the administration without being political on the market. EZ: I am glad you ask our monthly VIP brief that we do for clients and actually to the public. I’m supposed to write this month about the one year review of Trump because I wrote something right after he got elected in which I tried to be as optimistic as possible, at least in saying, look, that the guy is a businessman. So any rational business man, once they spend a little time, we’ll figure out that clean energy is a good deal for the US. And so we don’t want to actually kill it. A year later, I’m less optimistic that he’s a rational business man, let’s put it that way. I think the good news for the industry is that these guys, him and his administration, they do not understand how to pull the levers of power very well. And so they’ve certainly sought to lay a glove on the clean energy industry. So far I think they’ve been generally unsuccessful. I would argue that it’s largely that they don’t really know how this stuff works all that well. I think the Paris thing symbolically obviously was not great for the industry, but didn’t really make a difference on the day to day stuff. JP: I’d argue just countered with the amount of momentum that came out of people who have been announcing. You had Nike go this week on renewable energy, wait a minute, if you’re not going to do, we will. EZ: Corporate, certainly did, they jumped right into. There’s no question about that. But I think that the bullet that the industry largely dodged was tax reform. The tax credit at the federal level is the most important policy. Basically at the very end in the last year, as you know, they, they managed to more or less, I mean it’s complicated and getting into too much, but they more or less managed to um, get the tax credits exempted from what would have been a floor level type of policy, this BEAT provision without getting any more detailed than that. This is going to be very interested for project financing. There’s going to be a lot of rethinking and there’s going to be some reshuffling and in some ways what they did do at the end of the year will hurt the industry but not nearly as bad as it could’ve been. JP: Yeah, I agree. Going back to what the levers conversation, I mean, you look across the bureaucracy and you can’t just put an executive order that you actually have to manage that executive order. EZ: You can’t just tweet out that you’re not going to subject Florida off offshore drilling. There’s actually a process and the FERC thing and Secretary Perry’s effort to basically tell FERC what to do and say we want you to basically go reward coal fire generation and them saying, well actually that’s, that’s just not how this works. That to me is like kind of case in point of that’s not how the system works. JP: It was refreshing to see them come out and show that the systems work. EZ: Yeah, I mean there’s, you know, things take time as you know, you worked in government, right? It’s not like you don’t just wake up one morning and decide how you want things to go are you actually have to be very clear and strategic about it and they haven’t been so far. The U.S. Role in the Global Clean Energy Market JP: I’m going to talk about international. You talked about China, which is incredibly exciting and over two dozen countries last year invested more than a billion dollars in clean energy. What are we seeing out of the rest of the world and is our lack of leadership today stifling that or are we just falling behind? EZ: That’s a good question. I mean, the one thing I will say about sort of the rest of the world question is, look, the Chinese view this as a strategic opportunity on a lot of different levels and they are moving very quickly to get their clean energy equipment out to more markets. There are actually a variety of reasons for that. One of which is because they’ve built an unprecedented volume of manufacturing capacity back home and they do not want idle plants so that they want and they need markets. The second thing is that the one way them to actually exercise some soft power is to show up in a country and say hello, we will build you a nice big wind or solar project. We will bring you the equipment and by the way we will finance it to, through the China Development Bank. And they are being very, very aggressive about that. JP: It’s likely you will be using Chinese construction too. EZ: We’ll create it and for countries that have lack of access to capital and are interested in clean energy. It’s almost like a turnkey solution. They’re doing other things too, where they’re actually buying local developers. I was just in Brazil last week where National Grid has bought a company called CPFL, which is a local developer and owner of assets. We’re seeing more and more of that take place. So I think the reality of it is, that we focus a lot on Chinese as manufacturers but they are also international financiers and now developers as well. From a global and climate perspective, great. If they have the cheapest capital and they can do it, you know, fantastic. From a US competitiveness perspective it is not so great. Some Background on Bloomberg New Energy Finance JP: Thank you for all of this. For folks that aren’t familiar with the Bloomberg New Energy Finance, how do they get involved? How they engage you guys? EZ: Well firstly you can look us up on the web, but second of all, we have conferences, which are invite only, but we are certainly interested in people who want to attend or speak at those. We love having people read our stuff, which is, which is far from free but if you’re interested in subscribing, drop me a note. Advice for Your Younger Self JP: It’s interesting, we have a variety of listeners, folks that are really in the investment side. We’ve got students just learning about the space. So it’s quite an interesting group. So I always ask the same last question. Especially speaking to those folks just getting into the industry, if you could look back and you get quite an interesting sort of roller coaster of a career and you can give yourself a piece of advice coming out of high school or college. What would you say? EZ: Well, first off is to myself, I would say you should be a better student and take it more seriously, I was actually a pretty bad high school student. Then I would also say, you know, it’s not the end of the world if you’re aren’t a great high school student because you can make it up in college. When I first joined this industry, it was very much a small industry which showed a lot of promise, now that we’ve reached some real scale and some scope and that’s great. There are a lot of great opportunities out there for people to get involved. I do think that, as you know, as a person who’s an entrepreneur, there’s still a lot of areas for startup and there’s the one thing I am struck by and we’re very, as I said, very optimistic about the sort distributed energy aspect of all this is there’s a lot of, there’s a lot of small projects to be done. There’s millions of small projects to be done and it ultimately those add up to a lot of value. And I think so it’s not always about going off and trying to figure out how you find that it’s $100 million dollar wind farm. It’s about figuring out how you finance a $1 million rooftop or even $200,000 rooftop. We model it and the economics look great, but at the end of the day you need like an army of people to actually do all of this. So I think local development is something which is always going to be an opportunity and if you’re really a self-starter, entrepreneur, and enterprising, and you live in a place where either a power prices are really high or b, it’s very sunny or c both of those things. You might want to look around and see like, is there anybody I could talk to you about how I actually help them think about putting solar here. Have they thought ever thought about doing solar and, and you know, can I chat with them about it? Because the answer in many cases is, Huh? I never really thought about that. And so I think those are where the opportunities lie. Listen to other episodes of Experts Only.
Innovative and Resilient: Global Clean Energy Economy is Unstoppable This post was co-authored by Jon Powers and Zoe Berkery. Good news! Despite a range of uncertainties in 2017 and the beginning part of 2018, clean energy remains a strong economic driver with untapped investment opportunity. Clean energy investments are high, the private sector continues to be a driving force, and corporations are demanding clean energy at unprecedented levels. There are a lot ways to look back at 2017 when it comes to clean energy and the economy. There were many uncertainties facing the industry in 2017 that challenged the clean energy markets in new and unforeseen ways, however a recent report from the Business Council for Sustainable Energy (BCSE) and Bloomberg New Energy Finance (BNEF), the Sustainable Energy in America Factbook demonstrates how innovative and resilient the global and domestic clean energy market remains. As pointed out by a recent Wall Street Journal article, action by the Trump Administration like “tariffs may slow the rate of solar expansion, local and state policies requiring utilities to procure renewable energy will continue to help create a baseline market for solar power” Clean Energy is an Investment Opportunity Clean energy is maturing as an asset class ripe for investment. With 18.4 GW of global clean energy deployed in 2017, it’s not a surprise that more and more institutional investors continue to be drawn to these stable, long term cash flows. As a result, global clean energy investment rebounded in 2017 to the second-highest amount on record. In total $333 billion was invested in the sector in 2017, second only to the $360 billion spent in 2015. Private Sector and Localities Back Clean Energy The federal government may have backtracked from national and international engagement on climate change issues in 2017, but the private sector companies showed a united front regarding their commitment to address climate change. After the President indicated the U.S. would withdraw from the Paris Treaty, the “We Are Still In” movement responded with 2,642 mayors, governors, CEOs, college presidents, faith organizations, tribal leaders, and other small businesses (including CleanCapital) with renewed commitments to address climate change and reduce emissions. Similar initiatives like the U.S. Climate Alliance, includes 16 governors representing over 40% of the U.S. population and $7.4 trillion in economic output. Federal-level actions posed a number of threats to the clean energy economy beyond Paris, from trade cases to tax reform, the market was rife with uncertainty. Despite these policy uncertainties, the clean energy market expanded rapidly in 2017, demonstrating the industry’s resiliency. For example, according to the BCSE Factbook, wind and solar capacity in the US has increased more than 471% since 2008 (from 25 GW to 143 GW). Renewable generation soared 14% in 2017, adding 18.4 GW of capacity, now accounting for 18% of total U.S. generation—double the contribution a decade ago. Corporations Demand Clean Energy The Factbook also highlights that corporations continue to play an increasingly powerful role in the global energy transformation, demanding cleaner energy and seeking to capture savings from energy efficiency efforts. In the US, off-site corporate clean energy contracts rose to 2.9 GW in 2017, second only to the surge seen in 2015. Some of the world’s largest corporations now have ambitious clean energy goals, including Google, Apple and Facebook which continue to contract more clean energy. Kimberly-Clark, T-Mobile, General Mills and Cummins all signed their first clean energy contracts in 2017. Source: 2018 Sustainable Energy in America Factbook In addition, renewables increasingly just make better economic sense. New solar PV plants can now undercut new coal builds on a levelized cost of energy (LCOE) basis in the U.S. LCOE measures the lifetime cost over the lifetime energy production of a system, plant or technology in order to more fairly compare costs of various types of energy technologies. In other words, LCOE is a summary measure of the overall competitiveness of different generating technologies. Source: 2018 Sustainable Energy in America Factbook The bottom line is clean energy is here to stay and will continue to grow. These reports show that it is no longer an alternative energy, but a mainstream source of power. Now more than ever before it is going to be incumbent upon innovators to overcome the new challenges imposed by the federal government. CleanCapital is working to be a key player in this global clean energy transformation to more efficiently originate and invest in the clean energy infrastructure that is so critical to the future of the global economy. See the whole 2018 Sustainable Energy Factbook here.
Future remains bright for solar despite the Trump tariff Despite the Trump Administration’s assertion that it will benefit the solar industry, the decision to impose a tariff on solar panels will have the opposite effect. While attempting to prop up a handful of American manufacturing jobs that may never materialize, many more jobs installing solar systems are at risk as the pace of installations will slow. Some estimate as many as 23,000 jobs could be lost. But the solar industry has proven resilient through bigger threats, and the global demand for clean energy will eclipse this decision. The remedy imposed by the Administration will have a few immediate impacts on the industry. The decision will increase estimated solar costs by 10 to 12 cents per watt, based on current U.S. import prices of 35 to 40 cents per watt, according to analysis done by GTM Research. This could add up to 10% to the total cost of a solar project making some projects uneconomical, leaving installers out of work and slowing carbon-cutting clean energy deployment. To learn more about the facts behind the case, check out the CleanCapital Resource page, but here are some quick items: Office of the United States Trade Representative (PDF Fact Sheet) Solar Energy Industries Association (Statement) Bloomberg (Breakdown of Impact) GTM (Everything you need to know about Trump Tariff) But nothing can stop solar. Installation costs have fallen substantially in the past decade, making solar the most cost effective energy option in many states and countries. Following Swanson’s Law, solar costs will continue to fall over time despite this temporary setback. This will result in cleaner, cheaper electricity reaching more people over the next decade. Even as the cloud of the trade case loomed, U.S. investments in solar remained strong through 2017. A recent report from Bloomberg New Energy Finance (BNEF), found global investment in clean energy such as wind and solar reached about $333.5 billion in 2017, a 3% rise from the prior year, and just 7% below the record in 2015. This growth is attributed to technological advancements and declining hardware costs. Further, solar panels account for a decreasing percentage of a project’s capital costs. The near-term cost increase imposed by the new tariffs can be mitigated by a reduction in soft costs. Soft costs, costs outside of the manufacturing and installation of solar panels, account for 64% of the overall costs of going solar. Image courtesy U.S. Department of Energy Also, increasing capital markets participation and liquidity will bring more efficiency. At CleanCapital, we offer project owners the opportunity to exit their portfolios to free up capital. By bringing liquidity to this historically illiquid market, we are supporting project owners faced with immediate capital needs. Increasing the flow of capital across the clean energy marketplace remains a long-term necessity for the industry’s success. While the tariff will hurt the solar workforce, we must keep in mind that the tailwinds are forcefully behind solar energy. Costs will continue to go down, innovation will push new bounds, and the demand for a clean energy future will grow. The future is bright. Learn more about how we can provide liquidity for your projects.
Episode 14: Tom Matzzie [av_image src=’https://cleancapital.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/podcast-image-pageheader2.jpg’ attachment=’4329′ attachment_size=’full’ align=’center’ styling=” hover=” link=’page,249′ target=” caption=” font_size=” appearance=” overlay_opacity=’0.4′ overlay_color=’#000000′ overlay_text_color=’#ffffff’ copyright=” animation=’no-animation’ av_uid=’av-jwwgyb48′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”][/av_image] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwwgxszg’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] Episode 14: Tom Matzzie [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’10’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwl4lsb2′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] This week we sit down with Tom Matzzie, CEO and President of CleanChoice Energy. This conversation discusses wholesale energy markets. Tom breaks down how the complex markets work and how CleanChoice is making it faster and easier to participate in the space. Listen to learn about how technology and innovation are simplifying and driving broader adoption of clean energy through wholesale energy markets. Tom Matzzie is a strategist on politics, the media, and technology. Previously, he was Washington Director of MoveOn.org Political Action where he led U.S. campaigns to end the war in Iraq. He has been a strategist at the intersection of politics, the media, and technology for more than 10 years. [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwwh5253′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] Listen now [/av_textblock] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwl43nfd’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock textblock_styling_align=” textblock_styling=” textblock_styling_gap=” textblock_styling_mobile=” size=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” font_color=” color=” id=” custom_class=” template_class=” av_uid=’av-l66mxx99′ sc_version=’1.0′ admin_preview_bg=”] Transcript [/av_textblock] [av_textblock textblock_styling_align=” textblock_styling=” textblock_styling_gap=” textblock_styling_mobile=” size=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” font_color=” color=” id=” custom_class=” template_class=” av_uid=’av-l66n1cct’ sc_version=’1.0′ admin_preview_bg=”] Voiceover: Welcome to the Experts Only Podcast, sponsored by Clean Capital, where we explore the intersection of energy, innovation and finance. Our host is Clean Capital’s Co-founder and former Federal Chief Sustainability Officer, John Powers. Learn how clean Capital is revolutionizing clean energy finance, and find more episodes at cleancapital.com, iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. If you like what you hear, be sure to subscribe and leave us a five star review. Jon Powers: Welcome back to Clean Capital’s Experts Only Podcast. We’re joined today by Tom Matzzie, the President and CEO of Clean Choice Energy. We’re going to explore the wholesale markets with Tom. I’ve known Tom for over 10 years. He’s done an amazing job explaining the markets for folks. And if you aren’t as familiar with them as many of us, including myself should be, you learn a lot from the way he breaks it down. But we’re also going to talk about his transition from political advocacy, into clean energy and how, at Clean Choice, he’s helping make the experience for customers to move into clean energy, that much easier. Jon Powers: Tom, thank you so much for joining us on Experts Only Podcast. I want to talk a little bit about your personal history and our personal history. You and I’ve met over 10 years ago. It was one of my first visits actually, to Capitol Hill and we went to visit at that time, Senator Barack Obama. And we were going in to talk about what was happening in the war in Iraq. At that time, you were the Washington director of moveon.org. Talk a little bit about what got you into politics. Tom Matzzie: Sure. Thanks, John. It’s great to be on your podcast and it’s been great to know you over those 10 years, see the fantastic work you’ve been doing. I had always been attracted to politics. I grew up in Pittsburgh, and I think my story can’t be disconnected from growing up in Pittsburgh. It’s a town that has a working class culture associated with it as well. Even among the white collar professionals, there’s a working class sensibility. And with that comes a sense- Jon Powers: By the way, being from Buffalo, I completely understand that, 100%. Tom Matzzie: Yeah, exactly. Right. My father was a civil engineer. He was not blue collar, but he had the blue collar sensibilities, since he grew up in a steel mill town and all his buddies in high school, many of them were in blue collar jobs, et cetera. So that sensibility included a sense and understanding that politics was important and central to people’s lives. That politics could impact their livelihood, impact their healthcare, impact whether there were jobs, whether there’s economic growth. So I grew up around that. And with that understanding. I went to the University of Notre Dame. I studied economics and international peace studies, had great experience there and was always active and engaged outside of the classroom, I was restless and I always wanted to be doing something outside the classroom. And I moved to Washington DC in 1997 and started getting involved in different nonprofit advocacy groups and organizations right out of the gate. Tom Matzzie: In fact, that’s why I first met a couple of now rising political leaders, Tom Perriello, who was a member of Congress and ran for governor of Virginia was a friend of mine as early as ’97, when we were both doing different things in politics. And other people like Hans Reimer, who’s now the president of the Montgomery County Council in Maryland, and many others. And so, I’d always had that interest and I’d started to get involved. And then, what also happened at the same time is, I was very fluent in how to use the internet and technology in advocacy and in making change. And that gave me an opportunity to rise into leadership roles very early in my career, because it was the rise of the internet at the time. Jon Powers: Of course. Yeah. Tom Matzzie: And then suddenly, you could raise a budget to run a campaign while they let you spend it. Jon Powers: Right. And completely changing the dynamic, by the way, of how advocacy is being done. Tom Matzzie: I think so. And I think it’s led everything from the rise of the opposition to the Bush Administration’s excesses, to the election of President Obama, to the Arab Spring. And we’ve even probably seen a little bit of the boomerang on the negative effects of social media, now that we’re in this era of fake news and the ability to influence the public through dis intermediation and when that could be used by dishonest people. Jon Powers: Right. Like foreign nations that are impacting our elections. Yeah. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. So I’d always been involved and the first time we met it was… You were recently back from Iraq. I think you were six months or 12 months, within 12 months, I think you were back. And there’s a group organized through VoteVets, of veterans, mostly officers who had recently returned. And I recall very distinctly you were wearing your combat boots with a very neat suit and tie, that it made a distinct impression on me in those meetings. And I think it did on Senator Obama then as well. Jon Powers: Yeah. I grew up sort of similar backgrounds, but I had actually never gotten involved in politics in my life. And when I came back from the war, I was just so frustrated that the lack of leadership and what had sent us over to Iraq without a plan and so many different elements, I wanted to get into it. That the venue that you all gave me, and of course VoteVets, was life changing for me because I began to understand the bigger pieces at work and how to get involved in them. It’s what led me down politics is what led me down clean energy as well. Tom Matzzie: Well, we’re happy you’re in leadership. Jon Powers: Yeah. Thank you. So how did you make that shift then, from the political piece? I think that you really weaved the technology story in there well, because it was a critical part of what was happening at the time. And it’s what really drove the ’08 elections and OFA and these really exciting things. And shifting that from focusing it on helping to get folks elected and helping to move issues forward, to now helping to drive clean energy. What drove that shift for you? Tom Matzzie: Yeah. There were a couple different personal parts of the story for me. And some of it more just changing interests. After president Obama was elected, I had been involved in running massive campaigns through the second term of the Bush Administration, to elect the Democrats in the House and the Senate in 2006. And then, create a wave that someone like President Obama could ride that wave. It was a lot. And so, I decided to take a step back. I wasn’t the person who would send into government. I was the person that would just go break down walls. Tom Matzzie: And so, once the walls have been broken down, there were other people like yourself, who were more suited for 7:00 AM meetings in the White House. And I went into business, and I had a consulting business that was successful, but I was restless. I always had the itch to build something and not just be on conference calls, collecting consulting fees. So with that, I was looking for something to do. At the same time, there are other things going on in my life. One was, my father actually passed in 2010, from a form of cancer that was closely connected to the pollution in Western Pennsylvania that he grew up around. Jon Powers: I’m sorry to hear that. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. And there had been stories that he had told me and passed on to me when I was a kid about the pollution of his town, Ambridge, Pennsylvania, that he grew up in. Ambridge stood for the American Bridge Company. It was a steel mill town, and the stories were of the pollution that they would sweep off their front steps every morning from coal plants before they had any filters on them and had any soot regulations and other types of clean air rules. And the same form of cancer affected other members of his family, other members of his neighborhood, his community. So I had a sense of trying to wanting to do something that was about replacing dirty energy with clean energy. That was part of it. But I also had an interest in building something. And then, I went through the experience of putting solar on my own home in Washington DC. Tom Matzzie: And I describe that experience as awesome, but very difficult. I was extremely motivated to put solar on my home for all the personal reasons. Also, I think I’d have to say for my motivations, they were environmental, but also very technology oriented is, solar’s the future. I wanted to be part of the future. I wanted the iPhone. I didn’t want the rotary dial phone, but I described it as awesome and difficult. The company that did the installation, Bastrom Solar, did a fantastic job. They executed brilliantly and perfectly. It still took 11 months to complete the project. You had to fight the utility to get the meter completed. It was just a difficult process. And all of my instincts from politics where we were using technology to scale something, the core lesson from that experience was, you had to make the experience very, very easy for the participant. Tom Matzzie: And if you could make it very easy, you could get more scaling, and scaling could drive the success. And so from that insight that, if you could make it easier, more people would participate. We started looking for business models on my own, and then joined up with some other people. But the first business model with our company is retail electricity. And so, this is a choice where people have in 14 us states to… Which is 40% of all us electricity consumption, to choose their electricity provider. So it’s non Virginia, unfortunately, but it is in DC and Maryland and through the Northeast and parts of the Midwest and in Texas. And we’ve been scaling that business since 2013. Jon Powers: And that started as Ethical Electric right now and then moved to- Tom Matzzie: Yeah, our first name was Ethical Electric, which was the name I put on the PowerPoint when I pitched my first investor. Eventually I hired a chief marketing officer who said, “We’re going to test everything, Tom, including the name.” And so, because electricity’s an intangible product, you can’t touch it, taste it, feel it, hold it. We decided we needed a very descriptive company name that said basically, what our product is. Jon Powers: Yeah, no, I love it. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. That’s Clean Choice Energy today. Jon Powers: And so through that process, you guys are working in… First of all, great description of what Clean Choice is doing. You are empowering utility customers across the country. You’re helping them cut emissions, support clean energy through 100% retail renewable energy choices, community solar. Going back to what you said earlier, you’re making it easy for them to participate. I think, as folks that are in the industry with a passion to do this, wrestling with the multiple steps to get solar on your roof could be an incredible headache and most people would walk away from that. So how does Clean Choice make it easy for them? What are you doing to attract those customers in? Tom Matzzie: Right. For any entrepreneur or any business, there are essentially three value propositions. You could offer a customer better, faster or cheaper. All right. Those are the three. Rooftop solar is better and cheaper, but it’s not faster. In some ways maybe, it’s not better since it’s hard, but our product is better and faster, because it’s renewable energy and it just takes a minute to sign up for it. You just fill out a web form to enroll. It’s not cheaper right now. That’s one of the final hurdles we need to get over as a business for our core retail energy business. Although our community solar product is our first foray into a product that will be price competitive… Lower prices than a utility rate. Although I would note, all of our prices today are cheaper than what utilities we’re selling for, four years ago. Tom Matzzie: So even in our core product. It’s just that the utility rates have declined over the course of our business. So what we do when a customer signs up is, for the retail energy product, it’s a renewable energy. We’re licensed by the states. We’re a member of the wholesale energy markets and we go buy wholesale renewable energy, which includes both a financial swap, as well as a renewable energy credit, in order to then deliver the renewable energy to the customer, through their utility. And we’re a member of the wholesale power markets, the PJM and New York ISO and ISO New England and MISO. And we transact there with the suppliers, as well as with ultimately the customer’s utility. So we provide the energy to the customer’s utility via the ISO. Jon Powers: So if I’m a customer in Washington DC, and I sign up, you basically take the demand that my monthly household demand’s going to be, go into the market, buy it as renewables and then provide it to Pepco, who is really transmitting it into my house. Tom Matzzie: That’s 100% right. Of course, the electricity is fungible. And that’s the case for lots of other products. Water’s fungible. There’s a whole market for contracting for fungible products, whether it be electricity or water, other types of commodities, liquid fuels, et cetera are transacted in similar ways. Jon Powers: Absolutely. And so, from a structural perspective, you’ve got customer service teams reaching out, engaging and finding more customers. And then you have an entire purchasing shop that’s on the market, buying these things? Tom Matzzie: Yeah. So if you look at our business, marketing is a big part of it to aggregate consumers together. Operations, which is the customer experience from lead to cash. Then the other components include data and technology, which is very important to what we do, as well as the finance and procurement. And the procurement we are… You might call it trading. So we have trading relationships with wholesale energy suppliers, generators, and investment banks who provide financial derivatives. And that’s that procurement, it’s actually the least exciting and interesting part of our business. It doesn’t move very fast and that’s good. We’re not speculators. We’re buying, we’re transacting for our customers. There’s a part of the business that’s entering the wholesale power markets and transacting for the product for our customers. Jon Powers: And when you look across your portfolio, what you’re buying, it looks like a lot of it derives from wind today versus solar. Is that just because wind’s cheaper in the market? Tom Matzzie: That’s right. Wind is less expensive and actually more liquid. There’s more availability for wholesale supplied wind right now, in the markets that we operate in. Jon Powers: Outstanding. So talk a little bit about, you’re working in a variety of states and obviously from a regulatory perspective, they’re almost their own individual countries when it comes down to it. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. Jon Powers: How do you manage all of that regulatory differences from a team perspective? And then also, talk a little bit about your relationship with the utilities, because it’s got to be pretty important here. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. The relationship with the utilities just to touch on that, is a regulated one. So once we are licensed by the states, we were able to enter into what’s called a supplier agreement with the distribution utility, Pepco, ConEd, ComEd, et cetera. And they’re essentially required to do business with us as long as we are meeting our obligations under our license and the supplier agreement. And those obligations include, scheduling how much power our customers are going to use at the ISO, as well as credit, credibility, administrative, et cetera. It is regulatory complex. We have a large team, it’s 60 people just running the business. There’s another 20 doing our contact center. We have in-house regulatory council. We have law firms in every state. We regularly go and meet with state utility commissions on the staff side, sometimes the commissioners. Tom Matzzie: And we definitely have to keep track of all the obligations we have. The good news is, you can set up the business as a platform. So you write your customer contract, it’s in compliance with all of the requirements for each state and you have to monitor whether or not there are changes in those requirements, but by and large, it changes not frequently, once a year, something like that. And then, your other compliance or obligations are typically on the consumer protection side. Just don’t make false claims, make sure you have a validation of your contract with your customer, whether it’s a wet signature or a recorded phone call or some other internet signature or something like that. And you set up your business as a platform, you use business process automation to make it scalable. And it’s definitely achievable. Jon Powers: Are you finding once you get a customer, they’re pretty sticky? Tom Matzzie: I think there’s varying amounts of stickiness. Churn is part of our business. And it’s because the ability of the customer to leave us is a feature of the product, right? Jon Powers: Right. Tom Matzzie: And that’s important, I think to keep in mind is that customers want flexibility, and not just because they might leave. They might see an offer from a competitor. So we have to earn their business every day. Jon Powers: Oh, that’s interesting. So I always assumed it was much like when you sign up your electricity bill, and people sign up and forget, but there is a lot of competition in that space. Tom Matzzie: There’s competition, less green competition, but it’s just a feature of the product that the customer can leave. And I’ve talked about how our product is more expensive right now than a utility rate. That’s one of the final hurdles we need to overcome, that will materially improve churn. And community solar is one way to do that. And there could be future business models in an environment where there’s a carbon tax or something else, where our product becomes less expensive. Jon Powers: Yeah. I want to come back to that point specifically, because I want to talk a little bit about Secretary Perry and the FERC efforts that are going on. But before we leave, just Clean Choice overall, talk a little bit about, you guys had a recent announcement of launching an energy lab in New York City. What do you hope to accomplish with that? Tom Matzzie: A big part of what we do as a business is, use technology to make the customer experience better and to help us find the customers who are most interested in renewable energy. So we are using machine learning, artificial intelligence modeling, to predict which customers are most interested in renewable energy, and likelihood to stay around as our customer, all sorts of things like that. And so Clean Choice Energy Labs, which is open in New York City, and it also exists in our headquarters in Washington DC as well, is one of the places that we invest in the business to create the customer experience through technology and the data methods that we need, in order to be successful in our business. And we decided to really give it a little recognition with the branding and labeling, for the team led by our Chief Technology Officer, Daniel Murray, who came to us from the data operation of the Obama campaign, 2012. And he leads that part of our business, includes our platform for community solar that we’re developing in order to make it better customer experience for community solar customers, as well as what we’re doing today. Jon Powers: No, that’s really interesting. It’s a great way to drive innovation within a growing company. It’s exciting. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. Jon Powers: So going back to what we were talking about on pricing. And I think there’s a significant push by the Trump Administration, through Secretary Perry, to really bail out the coal industry here and specifically the pursuing a FERC ruling to financially allow power produced by coal plants, to charge a premium, allowing them to stay afloat. Provide some thoughts on this and where do you see it going? And what should the industry be doing to push back? Tom Matzzie: Yeah. So the wholesale electricity markets, in those markets today, there are a variety of different commodities that are procured and sold. It’s not just energy, actually. You would naturally assume you go to the whole energy market to buy energy. But the three core commodities that are procured in those markets are energy, which is what it sounds like. Capacity, which is the ability to have a lot of energy when you need it. And then flexibility, which is the ability to very quickly modulate how much energy is being consumed or generated very quickly. The out of whole cloth, the Trump Administration, it would appear to be at the urging of the CEO of a coal company have created some fictional, other need, which they’re terming resiliency, which is a 90 days of fuel on site that a power plant that can hold 90 days of fuel on site should be compensated for its ability to do it. Tom Matzzie: It’s a very wasteful use of resources. It’s the energy market equivalent of prepping, where you’re keeping hoards of food and water in your basement. And it’s an absurdity, because you think there should be no… The supply chain disruption that would be needed to not be able to deliver fuel to power plants for 90 days, would mean that there would be something so dramatic has happened in our country, that we would have much larger problems than whether or not the power plant has enough fuel for the next 90 days. And the reality is that, most resiliency risks in the energy market have nothing to do with the ability of power plants to turn on or off and whether they have fuel. We have lots and lots of power plants, way more power plants than we even need in the energy markets today. Tom Matzzie: The disruptions to resiliency and reliability for consumers come from power lines falling. Jon Powers: Exactly. Tom Matzzie: Everyone knows this. You get the blizzard, the tree loads up with snow, the tree falls, it knocks down the power line, the lights go out. That’s the story. That’s the total story of the real resiliency risk that most people face every day. There are certain places where they have transmission constraints. They don’t have enough power lines or you have additional reliability issues, but by and large, the threat to resiliency and reliability is driven by transmission distribution, line disruptions and not by power lines. And so what’s this all about? Look, it’s best I can tell, it’s about two or three companies who have close ties to the Trump Administration and are in danger of bankruptcy. And they are trying to get these bailouts to save their companies for what, maybe another nine months, other 12 months? Tom Matzzie: They want to disrupt the energy market design that has been very successful in lowering costs. I think this is one piece that people don’t appreciate is that, consumers and businesses have benefited from competitive power markets that have materially lowered costs for consumers over the last few decades. And this is be a massive disruption to that. We would be paying people who own power plants to just own the power plant, not to do anything that’s useful or generate electricity or something like that. Jon Powers: Yeah. The irony from one, not even to talk about the free market position a lot of these folks have started with now, they’re shifting over, but to look at when they talk about resiliency overall, it’s completely opposite of the way the military’s approaching it. It’s completely opposite of the way data center companies like Google and eBay and Amazon are approaching it. They’re looking at distributed onsite energy. As you said, it’s a complete handover to a handful of folks that… There’s obviously ways to slow role and rules and there’s going to be lawsuits around it. But if you could give advice to companies out there to get involved, what would you tell them? Tom Matzzie: Well, the first process is somewhat opaque in the end. It’s hard to know what the commissioners will- Jon Powers: Right, but it’s supposed to be independent too. Tom Matzzie: It’s supposed to be independent. I would say, we have some very good commissioners, even some of the Trump appointees. I think the former chairman who’s the interim chairman, Neil Chatterjee, Commissioner Chattergee has not shown himself to be a big supporter of competitive electricity markets. He seems to be more on the socialism end of energy markets and looking to give out corporate bailouts to power plate owners. And that’s been very disappointing to see. We have other commissioners, like commissioner Paulson, who was the former chair of the Pennsylvania Public Utility Commission. The Pennsylvania Commission was a very professionalized commission that was very straight shooter, would just put together regulations and to protect consumers and to do the right thing for the state. I don’t think he wants to disrupt competitive electricity markets. I think he’s a believer in the competitive electricity markets. We’ll see what Chairman McIntyre, who is the newest commissioner, what his perspective will be. It’s unclear so far, but I don’t think that there’s the other commissioners other than Chatterjee, are somehow coal idealogs. I think they believe in competitive power markets, and we’ll hopefully see that prove out. Jon Powers: Great feedback. Thank you. Tom Matzzie: Companies should get involved however they can. You should make a filing effort. I think the most important people that should be getting involved, are consumers. So if you own a big business, if you own data centers, if you own a steel mill, any sort of manufacturing at all, you are highly sensitive to electricity prices. And the Trump, Perry, Department of Energy Proposal to the FERC would increase power bills for consumers, but by more than $10 billion by some estimates. And that’s bad for US manufacturing, that people will be put out of work by that. It’s a real issue that needs to be taken seriously, the risks to American manufacturing from this terrible proposal to Federal Energy Regulatory Commission. Jon Powers: So Tom, to end on a lighter note, going back to yourself and Pittsburgh, when you’re coming out of high school or going back when you were graduating from Notre Dame, if you could sit down and have coffee or beer with yourself, what piece of advice would you give the younger version of you? Tom Matzzie: Oh wow. I had an opportunity to be a very early employee in broadcast.com, which Mark Cuban sold for a couple billion dollars. I turned that down. I don’t have any kind of business or political advice I would’ve given myself. I think I’ve made good choices in those regards, typically. I think the biggest lessons I’ve learned as I’ve got a little more gray in my beard now, I’ve starting to get a little gray in my beard, is really the value of relationships and friendships and just investing in those. So if you’re a young person today, those friendships and relationships you’re building are just going to be invaluable. Like us, John, we’ve known each other for 10 years. Jon Powers: It’s true. Tom Matzzie: And I think, you don’t always appreciate that until you’re a little older, how important and how much happiness they can bring you, to have those relationships. Jon Powers: That’s absolutely right. Well, Tom, thank you so much. And thanks so much for taking the time to join us today. Tom Matzzie: Yeah. Thank you. And congrats on all the success of your business. Jon Powers: Thank you. Tom Matzzie: Take care. Jon Powers: Well, thanks again to Tom, for joining us. What a fascinating conversation. You can go to cleanchoiceenergy.com to learn more about the work they’re doing. And always visit us at cleancapital.com. Give us your feedback on how we can improve this podcast. I’d like to thank our producers, Emily Conner, and Lauren Glickman, for their hard work as always. And thank you for listening and look forward to continuing the conversations. [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-26fbwx’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_social_share title=’Share this entry’ style=” buttons=” share_facebook=” share_twitter=” share_pinterest=” share_gplus=” share_reddit=” share_linkedin=” share_tumblr=” share_vk=” share_mail=” av-desktop-hide=” av-medium-hide=” av-small-hide=” av-mini-hide=” av_uid=’av-354olk’] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’40’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_button label=’More Podcasts’ link=’page,5266′ link_target=” size=’small’ position=’center’ label_display=” icon_select=’no’ icon=’ue800′ font=’entypo-fontello’ color=’theme-color’ custom_bg=’#444444′ custom_font=’#ffffff’ av_uid=’av-jx1x7jx3′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’40’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”]
Episode 13: Adam Browning [av_image src=’https://cleancapital.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/podcast-image-pageheader2.jpg’ attachment=’4329′ attachment_size=’full’ align=’center’ styling=” hover=” link=’page,249′ target=” caption=” font_size=” appearance=” overlay_opacity=’0.4′ overlay_color=’#000000′ overlay_text_color=’#ffffff’ copyright=” animation=’no-animation’ av_uid=’av-jwwgyb48′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”][/av_image] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwwgxszg’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] Episode 13: Adam Browning [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’10’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwl4lsb2′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] On this podcast, host Jon Powers sits down with Adam Browning, Executive Director of Vote Solar. We explore Vote Solar’s unique role in the marketplace. This conversation is especially timely given the political climate surrounding renewables at the federal level, pending tax reform, and the tariff case before the International Trade Commission. Adam leads Vote Solar’s team of advocates, experts and staff working to boost solar across the U.S. Adam co-founded the organization in 2002 after he worked on a successful local solar ballot initiative. Prior to Vote Solar, Adam spent eight years with the Environmental Protection Agency where he ran an award-winning pollution prevention program. Adam grew up in Miami and served with the Peace Corps in Guinea-Bissau and West Africa-experiences that taught him about the power of the sun. [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=’av-jwwgzkyu’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwwh5253′ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] Listen now [/av_textblock] [av_textblock size=” font_color=” color=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” av_uid=’av-jwl43nfd’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [/av_textblock] [av_hr class=’invisible’ height=’20’ shadow=’no-shadow’ position=’center’ custom_border=’av-border-thin’ custom_width=’50px’ custom_border_color=” custom_margin_top=’30px’ custom_margin_bottom=’30px’ icon_select=’yes’ custom_icon_color=” icon=’ue808′ font=’entypo-fontello’ av_uid=” custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=”] [av_textblock textblock_styling_align=” textblock_styling=” textblock_styling_gap=” textblock_styling_mobile=” size=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” font_color=” color=” id=” custom_class=” template_class=” av_uid=’av-l66mq2h3′ sc_version=’1.0′ admin_preview_bg=”] Transcript [/av_textblock] [av_textblock textblock_styling_align=” textblock_styling=” textblock_styling_gap=” textblock_styling_mobile=” size=” av-medium-font-size=” av-small-font-size=” av-mini-font-size=” font_color=” color=” id=” custom_class=” template_class=” av_uid=’av-l66ms7kg’ sc_version=’1.0′ admin_preview_bg=”] Voiceover: Welcome to the Experts Only podcast, sponsored by CleanCapital, where we explore the intersection of energy, innovation, and finance. Our host is CleanCapital’s co-founder and former federal chief sustainability officer, Jon Powers. Learn how CleanCapital is revolutionizing clean energy finance, and find more episodes at cleancapital.com, iTunes, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you like what you hear, be sure to subscribe and leave us a five-star review. Jon Powers: Welcome to CleanCapital’s Experts Only podcast. I’m your host, Jon Powers. We’ve got a great interview today with Vote Solar’s Adam Browning. Adam spent over 15 years leading Vote Solar, earning him the title across the industry as the Michael Jordan of solar policy. You’re in for a really interesting conversation as we explore not only what Vote Solar’s role is in terms of the solar marketplace, but where these fights are today. Jon Powers: We’re seeing so much happening at the federal level on pushback around the solar trade case, or Secretary Perry’s space. The real fight that many of us should be focused on is what’s happening at the state level, whether it be net metering in Nevada, fights in Florida, new policies in Pennsylvania and Illinois, stuff that we need to be tracking to move into the next market. Adam and I will be talking a lot about that. Jon Powers: I think if there’s any takeaway that I learned from him, it’s important for the states that are leading today just to get bolder and to hit on the targets that they’re achieving. I mean, California’s just announced recently they’re going to hit their targets early. It’s because of the advocacy at those levels. So I think you’ll learn a lot from this conversation. Let’s get started. Adam, thank you so much for joining us on Experts Only podcast. Adam Browning: Oh, I am excited to be here. Thanks for having me. Jon Powers: Yeah, of course. I want to start talking a little bit about your personal story in the space. You’ve had such a diverse background. Growing up in Miami. Joining the Peace Corps. Even spend some time in a federal agency. Tell me a little bit about your journey. First of all, how’d you end up joining the Peace Corps? Adam Browning: Ah, that’s an easy one. Going through college, I never had a real exact plan for what the next steps were. The idea of spending a bunch of time living in a simpler place and time, in the middle of nowhere, Africa, just seemed like the funnest, most exciting thing that anyone could ever want to do. It turns out I was right. Jon Powers: That’s great. What are some of the things you worked on when you were on the ground there? Adam Browning: Oh, I was in a little country called Guinea-Bissau in West Africa, just south of Senegal. The first group of volunteers doing some agriculture work. We were focused on rice growing. Tell you what. It was first year. It was really just about figuring out how to live. People were wonderful. The second year was really about trying to get some projects done. It was the most challenging experience that I ever had to that point and probably ever will, being a father notwithstanding. If it’s something that appeals to you, I recommend it to anybody at any point in their lives. Jon Powers: What are some of the lessons you took away from working on the ground there? Adam Browning: Honestly, a lot of lessons that transfer over to work today. One is take the time to really get to know the world that you’re living in. Do not expect results right away. Change, when it happens, can go quite slow. There are a lot of reasons for the status quo. When we hire somebody, I first sit down and let them know that I really want them to master their area and their subject matter, and not think that they need to blow things up and change things immediately. I think that was one big lesson. Let’s see. The other, really enjoying what you do is critically important. It’s all relationships. The more time you spend getting to know people and building your relationships and having joy in that, the better off you’ll be. Jon Powers: Yeah, absolutely. Coming out of that, how did you end up joining the EPA? Adam Browning: When I left, that was back in end of ’94. The economy was not good. Actually, I just took to Goodwill the first sports coat that I bought after coming back from Peace Corps, that I went around to local restaurants, trying to find a bus boy job, and couldn’t find work at all. Returning Peace Corps volunteers have special hiring status with the federal government, so I looked into that. EPA was a local agency. I had always been an environmentalist. I really focused on getting a job there, simply because I just looked like I had an easier in with my Peace Corps service. So that was where I ended up. Jon Powers: Were you working on energy stuff at EPA? What was your focus there? Adam Browning: My first effort with EPA was a lead-based paint program- Jon Powers: Oh, interesting. Adam Browning: … specifically focused on tribes, which have unique standing vis-à-vis the federal government. This was a grant program with the tribes in region nine, covering Arizona and Nevada, Hawaii and California. That was a really interesting program. I transitioned after a while into the toxics release inventory program. That ended up being fascinating work. I ended up doing a lot of enforcement-related work and then a lot of work with goldmines in Nevada, where I ended up. Jon Powers: Were you out in California then? Adam Browning: Yeah. Region nine, in the San Francisco office, out in California. Yep. Jon Powers: Excellent. What led from playing in the goldmines of Nevada to, in 2002, launching Vote Solar? Before getting into the Vote Solar piece, why did you want to get into the advocacy piece after having been on the service side and then the public service side? Adam Browning: Sure. Again, it wasn’t a plan that I had from the start, that I was just following out a path to a goal that I had. It’s more going from one interesting thing to the other. Working for the EPA, for the federal government, great introduction to understanding how environmental protection and our laws that our country have are applied and how it all works. There are some things left to be desired by working for the federal government. It’s a large bureaucracy. Innovation can be a little hard to come by. I’ve always enjoyed being my own boss. It wasn’t necessarily that I had a plan, but what ended up happening was I saw another opportunity and jumped on it. That specifically was an old college roommate, David Hochschild. Not actually a roommate. He was a hall mate. He was working for the mayor, Willie Brown, in San Francisco. He had an idea to try to put solar on city-owned buildings, do energy efficiency. That ended up becoming a ballot initiative. Adam Browning: I had never really been involved in a political process before. I found it exhilarating. We had really captured the imagination of a lot of people in the city. We had hundreds, if not thousands, of volunteers that were really excited about this idea of a transition to renewable energy. For me personally, doing a lot of enforcement with the EPA, fining people for what’s coming out of their smokestacks, this whole idea of you don’t even need control equipment. There’s no enforcement necessary. We’re just going to skip the whole smokestack route altogether. Really, it had visceral appeal of going to a cheaper, cleaner, faster, better way of producing energy. Of course, solar, at that point, wasn’t cheaper, but we had a vision for it. Through economies of scale, you could bring down the costs. That was the whole idea behind the San Francisco Solar Bond, Proposition B, in 2001. Jon Powers: Interesting. I have a similar path. When I left the military, I had never done anything political in my life. Came home and had a friend who had been working on Kerry’s presidential race. She knew I was an Iraq vet. Had me go out to Iowa to campaign, and for the first time was on the ground, talking to folks about my experiences. It just led me in a completely different path in life. Jon Powers: Later on, when I sat in a federal seat and worked across the agencies on their energy footprint, it became really apparent to me how important those voices, the voices of folks that were actually working in these issues, are. And then having them come and advocate for their positions, it’s something that the people sitting in these seats, especially here in Washington, but I’d say equally in Sacramento or in Albany, I’m from New York, originally. They’re experts as far as they can go. But the real voices they need are the ones that are out there doing the work. That kind of advocacy can be game changing. Obviously, it’s probably why you started Vote Solar. Talk a little bit about transitioning from that ballot initiative into co-founding Vote Solar in 2002. Adam Browning: Yeah. Well, let me just riff on your story as well. What I have found, and it sounds like you as well, people really want to be a part of something bigger than themselves. They genuinely are interested in seeing change. The difficulty is trying to provide the right vessel, the right vehicle, the right space, where you can actually get involved and make something happen. That’s what I feel is where solar and part of the foundational premise of Vote Solar comes in. After we pass that ballot initiative, which is, again, just to do solar and energy efficiency on city-owned buildings, and have the energy savings pay for those capital retrofits, we had calls from cities around the country. We had New York Times calling. It quickly became apparent that there was a hunger for this kind of change out there that led us to decide to quit our jobs and start a new nonprofit focused on replicating those city-led initiatives the best we could. Adam Browning: We quickly found out that, while city-led initiatives were good in and of themselves, where the real rules were made was at state-level policies. You had to have the right state-level enabling infrastructure to allow for a city or a person to take advantage of one of the real strengths of solar, which is that you don’t have to wait for your utility to do the right thing. You can take it upon yourself to invest in this, a mission-free technology, and to fundamentally participate in democracy and environmental decision making. But in order to allow that to happen, you have to have the right regulatory infrastructure in order to enable people to choose to make their own power through solar energy, whether you’re a person or whether you’re a city. So we changed the orientation and the focus of the organization to state-level policies. Jon Powers: Very focused in California in the beginning, right? I mean, you guys were really laying the groundwork for what ended up rolling across the country throughout the rest of the decade. Adam Browning: Exactly. When we got our start, there was a cap on net metering in California at 0.1% of total demand. Everyone at the utility side saying, “To expand that would risk grid failure and a business model collapse.” I didn’t know it at the time, but the next 15 years of my life would really be defined by incrementally expanding that cap to where we don’t have one right now in California at all. Jon Powers: It’s funny to hear those are the arguments, the counter arguments. It’s almost the same every time they want to shift. It’s the same argument they’re making today. Adam Browning: Exactly. The arguments are different now, only slightly. But yeah, we knocked down some of those impossible barriers a long time ago, or had to knock on them. But yeah, for many years Vote Solar was two people, then three people, then four people. The first big focus was in California, on the California Solar Initiative, a big, market-based incentive program that provided incentives for rooftop solar. Back then, solar was nine, 10 bucks a watt. Doing unincentivized solar wasn’t really possible in that market. So the whole idea was to establish this incentive program that would wean itself, that would lead to an end, at which point, it wasn’t necessary anymore and would go away. I think this is one of these wonderful examples that you don’t see all that often, of policy living up to its premise to a T, to deliver exactly what it’s set out to do, and ride off into the sunset. We hold up that as evidence of a very successful program. Jon Powers: It really did lay the foundation. When the next step, you started to look nationally, what are you going to do to drive down the cost of power or cost of these panels? You’ve got efforts like I think President Bush’s Energy Policy Act that set the investment tax credit in place. That was around 2005. Didn’t really get going in the market until 2007, maybe ’08, until we started seeing money really flow there. But all the state-level foundational work that you did, married to the federal stuff, started a pretty critical set of chain reactions, where policy lined up with markets. Jon Powers: I was doing some homework before we were doing interviews. I was looking just to even find the amount of installed solar in 2002. It’s really hard data to find because there wasn’t a whole lot out there. You flash forward now, where the end of 2016, the US had 40 gigawatts of installed PV, almost double the capacity from the previous year. In 2016, 39% of all new electricity generation in the country came from solar, ahead of even natural gas. We’re seeing employment numbers of this industry take off, where now we’ve gone from a nascent alternative energy to what’s really mainstream. Jon Powers: What I really want to talk about now is looking ahead, we’re at a unique time in the federal space, and then dive into the state conversation more deeply with you. But starting with the federal space, post the Obama administration, if you followed Energy Policy Act into the certain policies that came out of the Obama administration to help drive down the cost, things like SunShot that drive down the cost of the actual equipment. Now we’re at a place where the market is moving. Installations are happening at record numbers. But we’re facing two dramatic federal lines of attack. One is the solar trade case, which I want to talk a little bit about. And, of course, Secretary Perry’s recent push to really subsidize the coal industry. As you’re seeing this happen, how are you viewing those plays and how they’re going to affect us going forward? Adam Browning: Sure. Yeah. As an organization, our focus has always been focused on state-level policy. We’ve let the federal policy in the very good hands of SEIA, provided grassroots support for federal initiatives around the tax credit and the like. But our mantra has always been that state-level policy is where the most important rules of the road are set. So done a ton of RPSs and net metering and financing programs and tax policy around the country since then. After Trump was elected, it became really clear that we’re going to make progress in those times, that state-level policy, it was really where it’s at. The big states needed to go bigger. We needed to get good wins in some of the harder states to do, and we needed to play defense everywhere. I have to say, I have been surprised. It came as a surprise, just the magnitude of the federal resistance that we’ve seen so far. Did not anticipate this trade case, which, as you know, could double the price of modules, potentially. Jon Powers: Ironically, you’re seeing conservatives like Sean Hannity coming out against it and supporting, I think, the SEIA or the solar position on it, which is interesting. Adam Browning: It is quite interesting. Love to see that. At the same time, you look at, coming out of Perry’s DOE, a proposal to fundamentally blow up competitive energy markets to provide subsidies for out of the money coal and nuke plants, to the detriment of renewables and natural gas. This is something that is in direct contradiction with the rhetoric coming out of a party that is nominally used to competitive markets, or professes to be supportive of such. So really did not expect just the radical nature of the proposals to just make everybody pay more, to subsidize polluting coal and, again, destroy competitive markets and the pursuit of such. That is definitely something that we all need to have our eye on and fight as hard as we can for. Jon Powers: Yeah. I mean, it’s interesting. If you look back when this conversation started, when Perry landed there, there was certain folks within DOE who are politicized and trying to move this base load agenda. This summer, you and I did a joint op-ed pushing back on what’s expected to be the grid report, that I think they were hoping was going to empower them to go and really go after things like state RPSs and net metering. What it came out to show was, oh, no, actually, renewables are doing really well in the grid. As we argued, there’s real resilience in renewables. Then they seem like, “Oh, since that didn’t work like they had it planned, they decided to start going after FERC rules to try to provide subsidies of coal.” Then you’ve got major players like PJM and others coming out saying, “Wait a minute. Don’t distort the market like this.” Which is a really interesting counterattack that I don’t think I even saw coming, where you saw some of the major players who usually are relatively quiet on this stuff, saying, “Whoa, hold your horses. Let’s let the market play here.” Adam Browning: 100% in agreement. In fact, when it was first floated, it didn’t even seem like something that we would need to provide too much advocacy focus on. It was too crazy, so far out of the mainstream, and so contradictory to things that are delivering great benefits to consumers through competitive markets, that it was just implausible that it would actually go forward. When you see some of the FERC commissioners providing supportive statements to elements of it, you really start to worry. This is something, again, that should be treated as just beyond the pale, and not really potentially being internalized. So there’s a lot more danger there. Jon Powers: Making interesting bedfellows with folks like the solar industry and the natural gas industry coming together on pushback. Let’s transition out of the federal space because I think those fights are going to happen, and we’ve got to all play an active role in pushing back on them. But it also really shines a light on the importance of focusing on state-level solutions. There’s been a lot of activity in 2016 and, of course, here in 2017 that are affecting the space. You guys have been very active. Everything from the recent elections here in Virginia and in New Jersey, what those mean for clean energy, but also some of the fights that you’ve been leading in Nevada and Florida, can you talk a little bit about what Vote Solar’s doing there? Adam Browning: Sure. Yeah. I do think it’s a case where the big leading states need to get bolder and go farther. Let’s just, again, start with California real quickly. The California Public Utilities Commission just released a report saying that this state could meet its 50% RPS. It’s on track to meet 50% RPS 10 years early, by 2020, so just a few years out, which really sets the bar for what is possible around the country. This past year, I think, has been a really dynamic showcase of what really is possible at the state level. Let’s begin with Nevada, where back almost two years ago now, you had solar’s worst loss ever. Absolutely the crushing of net metering. In the intervening 16 months, you had a ton of advocacy work that went into that state. We had people full time working on bringing back solar to Nevada. We had lawsuits going. We had regulatory strategy, legislative strategy. Adam Browning: The sum result of a lot of partners also working on this is that you had the most successful legislative session in, I would say, any state at any time. You had 11 major energy bills pass. Only nine of them were signed. The governor dropped the ball on the 40% RPS and our community solar bill, but you brought back full retail. Net metering, the rooftop solar market is moving forward. I would say that this was a real example of where the enemies of progress had a pretty pyrrhic victory. At the same time, you had a ballot initiative Nevada passed by a record 73% to essentially blow up Nevada energy in the IOUs and have a competitive market. It has to pass twice, so it hasn’t yet happened. Nonetheless, you saw the will of the voters. Adam Browning: We’ve got polling to show that after the big solar loss, where solar became a front-page issue for months, it affected electoral politics across the board. You had, in the race to succeed, Senator Harry Reed, one candidate taking a pro-solar position, and one taking an anti-solar position. We have polling to show that people held that solar view against Joe Heck and rewarded Catherine Cortez Masto, now the senator, accordingly. So this is a place where you’ve seen, really, solar flex its electoral muscles. You look across the country, and super majorities want to see this transition to renewable energy. Here is a place where you actually saw that play out at the polls. Adam Browning: Florida is another place where we saw some really helpful activity. I grew up in Miami, so I think I’m allowed to say, “Man, nothing good ever comes out of Florida.” That’s hyperbole, of course. But it’s just really hard to get wins in the Sunshine State. You have to go back to 2008 with Governor Crist to see when we had a huge win on net metering. But what we saw this past year, we worked with the Republican-dominated state legislature to put a tax abatement issue on the ballot. The ballot was on the primary last August, and it passed, again, by 73% of the vote. Then the legislature had to vote on it again to implement it. So three times. Twice in the legislature won. The huge majority of the people wanting to see this property tax abatement, which effectively lowers the cost of solar around 20%, in the third largest, most populous state in the country. So it’s really a big deal pass. This is a another example where you’re seeing, really, solar become an electoral issue, something that politicians have to pay attention to. Adam Browning: Flip forward to the just a few weeks ago, where you saw both in New Jersey and in Virginia, pro-solar leaders, pro-renewable energy leaders, get elected. The Virginia governor adopted 100% renewable platform, and the New Jersey governor has some really strong, renewable credentials. Those were pretty tightly contested races, but I think this is really the way of the future, where you see, in effect, in the absence of federal government leadership. In fact, when you’re looking at federal government intransigence on this subject, politicians really understanding that that is not where the people are at. The people want to see this transition. This is a vehicle to get elected. Jon Powers: These are deeply technical regulatory issues in many cases. I mean, obviously, someone in the industry, we can understand that. But to get people active and to vote on these and to help educate them on, whether it be regulatory issues, you mentioned IOUs earlier. If you went to Buffalo and polled, 99% of the people in Buffalo aren’t going to know an IOU is. So how do you educate voters? What role do folks in the industry have helping to do that? And then for listeners, how can they get up to speed and help advocate and push some of these things locally? Adam Browning: Just want to be clear from the outset that Vote Solar is a 501(c)(3) advocacy organization. As an organization, we can’t do electoral work. We can only do regulatory and a limited amount of legislative work. Jon Powers: But you can educate. Adam Browning: But I can certainly provide my personal opinion, which is that politicians rarely lead. They follow. It’s incumbent upon everyone to let their local leaders know what it is that they want to see in terms of for their future. You can always get involved in your local, state-level, and regulatory work through organizations like Vote Solar, where one of the fundamental premises of what we try to do is to get a decision on an important clean energy issue teed up for a vote at a commission, and then enable Vote Solar members to then be able to voice their opinion and say, “Look, you’re public policymakers. We’re the public. This is what we want to see at the state level.” Adam Browning: When it comes to the electoral politics, it’s up to individuals to contact their politicians to let them know that this is the type of policy that they want to see future leaders enact. I think the Sierra Club is doing an awesome job, as well as with Environment America, some of our good friends and partners there, on getting cities to sign up for 100% renewable energy or clean energy standards. Now, they still need state-level policies in order to live up to that goal. But it is a very clear demonstration that that is where the people end up wanting to go. Jon Powers: You guys have resources at votesolar.org for folks to get on and learn more? Adam Browning: The whole idea, exactly, is please, you become a member. Then we only ask for your zip code. That’s enable, both your name and your zip code. That means that when there is an important solar issue happening, generally at the state level, we plug you in, let you know what our campaigns are, wherever you may be, and keep you involved. Let you know when it is time to call the public utilities commission or call your state senator or representative to say you’re a rate payer. You’re a citizen. You’re a voter. This is the issue that is important to you. A lot of our work, we build these complex, super wonky arguments, do a lot of math to prove that solar alternative is better, and intervene legalistic ways in these important regulatory cases to, again, prove by math that we’re right. But you never win just because you’re right. You also have to align the politics with the outcome that you want to see. That’s where the people writ large come in. Jon Powers: I challenge all the listeners to go to votesolar.org, check it out. There’s new battlegrounds in places like Pennsylvania, where we can support the governor’s new initiatives on community solar, or Illinois, or Iowa. So get involved. Learn more from how you can get involved. Adam, I always leave on a final question. You’ve had such an incredible career in this space. If you can sit down with yourself coming out of high school in Miami, or coming out of college and heading to the Peace Corps, what advice would you give yourself? Adam Browning: I’m going to answer this two ways. I mean, on a personal level, I would tell everyone to follow their passion. Don’t think in terms of their whole career. Think in terms of what they really want to be working on now. Secondly, as someone who does a lot of hiring, I would tell people the one degree that I look for is a GSD. MAs and PhDs are awesome as far as it goes. But I also want to see that someone’s got a track record of getting stuff done. That is what my interviews are always focused on. Sure, you spent X amount of time at such place, but what did you deliver? What did you get done? Keep that in mind. That is the most valuable thing that you can ever use in any job interview. Jon Powers: That’s great. Well, you guys are definitely getting stuff done at Vote Solar. Thanks so much for taking the time today. We look forward to continuing to keep progress. As things are happening, be sure to come back, so we can talk about where folks can get involved in these state fights. Adam Browning: Thank you much. You keep up the great work yourself, Jon. Jon Powers: Thanks, Adam. Well, a lot to take out of that conversation with Adam Browning today. Go to votesolar.org to learn more about how you can get involved. If you’re not involved at the state level, these are where the fights are happening to really ensure that the marketplace continues to grow, both for solar, but also other clean energy technologies across the board. If I learned anything when I was in the federal government, it’s those folks that are working in the industry are passionate about the industry. That could be some of the most important advocates moving ahead. I just wanted to thank our producers, Lauren Glickman and Emily Connor, for their hard work. As always, if you have thoughts or advice on the show, please provide them at cleancapital.com. You can find our other episodes there. Look forward to continuing the conversation. 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CleanCapital 2017 Year in Review By Thomas Byrne, Jon Powers and Marc Garrett 2017 was a big year for CleanCapital. As a company, we continue to revolutionize the clean energy market through simpler finance. Clean energy remains a largely untapped investment opportunity for many unfamiliar with the asset class and developers lacking access to capital needed. CleanCapital is addressing these issues by creating a marketplace that provides opportunities for investors and access to capital for developers, through a platform that identifies, screens, and manages clean energy projects. Here are some of our major accomplishments of 2017: Our investors have kept 18,000+ tons of CO2 out of the atmosphere by funding solar projects. Climate change is a threat multiplier, that’s why CleanCapital is accelerating clean energy through simpler finance. Expanding opportunities for clean energy investing We are expanding opportunities for clean energy investing. In 2017, we acquired nearly $30M in operation solar projects. That’s 330 operating solar projects, over 16 Megawatts (MW) in 5 states. This brings our total to over 24 MW in 10 states. Closed our series A In November, wee closed $3.7M in Series A financing. This investment came through 50 investors to include FinTech and CleanTech leaders and will allow us to accelerate implementation of our technology roadmap, scale operations, grow our team, and expand opportunities for clean energy investing. Learn from Experts Only podcast We launched the new Experts Only podcast in 2017. To date, we’ve released 12 Episodes featuring conversations that explore the intersection of energy, innovation and finance. Our final episode of 2017 featured Adam Browning, Executive Director of Vote Solar. We already have exciting conversations lined up for the new year and we can’t wait to share them with you. Make sure you’re subscribed to listen wherever you get your podcasts. We also spent time updating our brand and website, expanding our team, scaling operations and providing thought leadership across the clean energy industry. [av_button label=’View Our Impact’ link=’manually,https://cleancapital.com/year2017/’ size=’small’ position=’center’ icon_select=’no’ icon=’ue800′ font=’entypo-fontello’ color=’theme-color’ custom_bg=’#444444′ custom_font=’#ffffff’ custom_class=” admin_preview_bg=” av_uid=’av-30z83n’] * MWh are a calculated with real data and projections from projects acquired in 2017 ** Calculations based on EPA Greenhouse Gas Equivalencies Calculator